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Old 11-22-2020, 02:37 PM   #1
Meo-Ada Mespotine
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Default Reaper on Arm-Macs - pre-release discussion thread

For those early adopters, who already have Arm-Macs, you can find an arm-build of Reaper on LOL.
You can also test the current Reaper-builds to see, how stable they are with Rosetta 2.

As of wish by Justin to discuss this better in the pre-release-thread(specifically the arm-build) I just opened a thread for that.

This is the original thread where it all was discussed.
https://forum.cockos.com/showthread....76#post2367976


Happy Arming
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Old 11-22-2020, 06:50 PM   #2
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Any insight on IOS AUv3 being supported ?
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Old 11-24-2020, 03:38 AM   #3
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Default SWS and ARM?

The macOS ARM64 (beta) Release looks promising.

In terms of performance, we'll want to focus on the ARM-Release, not the Rosetta2 version.
My MBP M1 arrived just yesterday, and I did some quick tests:

Rendering MP3:
- on Rosetta2 : 2,7x Realtime
- on ARM native: 83x Realtime

O__O

My biggest complain right now: I couldn't find a new SWS Version for the ARM build. Hence 90% of our Ultraschall-Skripts depend on SWS, this is a showstopper. Are there any plans to produce an ARM compatible version, or do I just miss something?
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Old 11-24-2020, 03:54 AM   #4
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Request ARM support in the SWS thread. Justin/Schwa might help out a bit, since Reaper has supported the ARM platform for quite a while now.

The Mac Mini M1 seems like one heck of a little powerhouse right about how.
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Old 11-24-2020, 05:14 AM   #5
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See https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?p=2367303 for experimental arm64 builds. It would be helpful to hear back whether they work on the new Apple hardware. Please post any issues with them at https://github.com/reaper-oss/sws/issues.
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Old 11-24-2020, 05:22 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cfillion View Post
See https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?p=2367303 for experimental arm64 builds. It would be helpful to hear back whether they work on the new Apple hardware. Please post any issues with them at https://github.com/reaper-oss/sws/issues.
Sweet, looking good so far!
Now still missing:

reaper_js_ReaScriptAPI
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Old 11-24-2020, 12:08 PM   #7
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For those who can test, what is the output of the ReaScript function GetOS on arm-reaper?
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Old 11-24-2020, 12:31 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Meo-Ada Mespotine View Post
For those who can test, what is the output of the ReaScript function GetOS on arm-reaper?
OSX64
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Old 11-24-2020, 01:40 PM   #9
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Thnx. Hmm, so it's no chance to get that there's an arm-version currently installed yet.

Edit: What about reaper.GetAppVersion() ?
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Old 11-24-2020, 01:46 PM   #10
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GetAppVersion() changed in 6.16 from 6.15 (oops this might break old scripts), now it returns the string in the about box title, currently:

"6.16/OSX64-icc"
"6.16/OSX32"
"6.16/OSX64-arm"
"6.16/linux-x86_64"
"6.16/linux-i686"
"6.16/linux-armv7l"
"6.16/linux-aarch64"
"6.16/win64"
"6.16/win32"


(so probably best to use strstr() on these...)
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Old 11-24-2020, 02:33 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin View Post
GetAppVersion() changed in 6.16 from 6.15 (oops this might break old scripts), now it returns the string in the about box title, currently:

"6.16/OSX64-icc"
"6.16/OSX32"
"6.16/OSX64-arm"
"6.16/linux-x86_64"
"6.16/linux-i686"
"6.16/linux-armv7l"
"6.16/linux-aarch64"
"6.16/win64"
"6.16/win32"


(so probably best to use strstr() on these...)
Great! Exactly the info I was looking for
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Old 11-24-2020, 03:30 PM   #12
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@all
FeedTheCat made an update to his Reaper-autoupdate-script, which now supports autoinstalling Arm-Reaper as well.
https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=242922&page=4


@Justin
Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin View Post
GetAppVersion() changed in 6.16 from 6.15 (oops this might break old scripts), now it returns the string in the about box title, currently:

"6.16/OSX64-icc"
"6.16/OSX32"
"6.16/OSX64-arm"
"6.16/linux-x86_64"
"6.16/linux-i686"
"6.16/linux-armv7l"
"6.16/linux-aarch64"
"6.16/win64"
"6.16/win32"


(so probably best to use strstr() on these...)


Why not returning this string as an additional return-value to keep old scripts working?

Edit: Ooof.. this breaks all kind of parts of Ultraschall-API. Now I need to find a way that works with older and newer releases of Reaper.
Not really amused... :/

Edit2:
How and where are rc and dev-releases included in this string? Like +dev0423 and rc9 and such?
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Last edited by Meo-Ada Mespotine; 11-24-2020 at 04:36 PM.
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Old 11-25-2020, 01:43 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rstockm View Post
The macOS ARM64 (beta) Release looks promising.
In terms of performance, we'll want to focus on the ARM-Release, not the Rosetta2 version.
My MBP M1 arrived just yesterday, and I did some quick tests:

Rendering MP3:
- on Rosetta2 : 2,7x Realtime
- on ARM native: 83x Realtime
I did some further research: the MP3 rendering under Rosetta2 is not a problem in terms of performance. The problem was a JSFX Effect (Dynamics) which was up and running, but really slow.
JSFX seems wo work just fine in the ARM Beta, thats good news too.
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Old 11-25-2020, 04:26 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Meo-Ada Mespotine View Post
@all
FeedTheCat made an update to his Reaper-autoupdate-script, which now supports autoinstalling Arm-Reaper as well.
https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=242922&page=4


@Justin




Why not returning this string as an additional return-value to keep old scripts working?

Edit: Ooof.. this breaks all kind of parts of Ultraschall-API. Now I need to find a way that works with older and newer releases of Reaper.
Not really amused... :/

Edit2:
How and where are rc and dev-releases included in this string? Like +dev0423 and rc9 and such?

Hmm we'll restore that API's behavior for 6.17:

GetOS() will return Win32, Win64, OSX64, OSX64 or macOS-arm64, or Other. GetAppVersion() will return 6.17/OSX64 or 6.17/x64 or 6.17 (implies win32) or 6.17/macOS-arm64 or 6.17/linux-etc

Last edited by Justin; 11-25-2020 at 04:46 PM.
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Old 11-27-2020, 12:32 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin View Post
Hmm we'll restore that API's behavior for 6.17:

GetOS() will return Win32, Win64, OSX64, OSX64 or macOS-arm64, or Other. GetAppVersion() will return 6.17/OSX64 or 6.17/x64 or 6.17 (implies win32) or 6.17/macOS-arm64 or 6.17/linux-etc
Thanx. Though I had just finished my rework. ARGHH

But no problem, I can easily revert these.
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Old 12-05-2020, 04:38 AM   #16
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Default Can't record system Mic

Hi all!
Can anyone record via the laptop's mic? I can't seem to be able. I think Reaper is supposed to ask me at some point to allow Reaper the permission to use the internal mic but it never does.
Can anyone confirm this? Or have any idea how to make this work?

EDIT: Ok a little bit of Googling led me to this workaround. Using this command in the terminal forced the Microphone permission to appear: open /Applications/REAPER.app/Contents/MacOS/REAPER

But you have to do it each time though (if you want to record via the internal mic), so a more durable solution would be cool

Last edited by pyercoffin; 12-05-2020 at 05:27 AM.
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Old 12-07-2020, 12:49 PM   #17
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Quick update from me guys!

Have my system running on the M1 Mac Mini since a few hours. Cool thing is that you can install both the Intel version and ARM versions! With Rosetta, I can run my regular projects, my Fabfilter plugins work flawlessly then (its also the only bundle I use on a day to day basis right now).

On the ARM64 version, I do have great performance from a latency perspective (16 samples over AVB), however, I do not have any VST3 Fabfilters, so I can't open my projects to do a real performance shootout. The Fabfilters run on VST and AU... Not sure if this is a "fabfilter is not optimised" thing or a bug or Rosetta? Apart from that, it's pretty solid!

Anyway, I'll keep you all posted on my findings
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Old 12-14-2020, 10:40 AM   #18
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I noticed on White Sea Studio's youtube video he noted that render time on a fairly simple project was quite slow using the M1. This surprised me considering how amazing the M1 apparently is at doing video exporting etc according to all the reviewers on youtube.

Wondering if there has been any other issues reported?

I just fired up REAPER on an M1 macbook air. I'm interested in native performance with stock plugins only, I think I'll skip trying to do anything in rosetta or with x86/64 plugins.

Anyone else giving this a real go yet?
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Old 12-14-2020, 11:57 AM   #19
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Fabfilter just released m1 native versions of their plugins, apparently because they had lots of experience making versions for iOS.
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Old 12-15-2020, 11:47 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by airon View Post
Fabfilter just released m1 native versions of their plugins, apparently because they had lots of experience making versions for iOS.
Following.
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Old 12-15-2020, 08:08 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by klong View Post
I noticed on White Sea Studio's youtube video he noted that render time on a fairly simple project was quite slow using the M1. This surprised me considering how amazing the M1 apparently is at doing video exporting etc according to all the reviewers on youtube.

Wondering if there has been any other issues reported?

I just fired up REAPER on an M1 macbook air. I'm interested in native performance with stock plugins only, I think I'll skip trying to do anything in rosetta or with x86/64 plugins.

Anyone else giving this a real go yet?
White Sea doesnt know it, but he set his realtime buffersize to 16 samples, and didnt change it back before he rendered/exported. by default reaper uses the playback sample buffer size for rendering
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Old 12-16-2020, 02:35 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Magoostus View Post
White Sea doesnt know it, but he set his realtime buffersize to 16 samples, and didnt change it back before he rendered/exported. by default reaper uses the playback sample buffer size for rendering
WOOOOW! I just tested this... This is true!

wow. wow. wow.

Doesn't make sense for me yet, because what has the audio interface block size to do with an offline (disconnected?) render? But, apparently, there is a connection between those 2... And it's a rather big one I see now that I've tried a render at 1024...

Time to make a video about this 🙃
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Old 12-16-2020, 10:26 AM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by White Sea Studio View Post
WOOOOW! I just tested this... This is true!

wow. wow. wow.

Doesn't make sense for me yet, because what has the audio interface block size to do with an offline (disconnected?) render? But, apparently, there is a connection between those 2... And it's a rather big one I see now that I've tried a render at 1024...

Time to make a video about this 🙃
you *can* set render sample buffer size manually in settings/preferences, its under Audio>Rendering> "Block size to use when rendering: (leave blank for auto)"
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Old 12-17-2020, 01:48 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Magoostus View Post
you *can* set render sample buffer size manually in settings/preferences, its under Audio>Rendering> "Block size to use when rendering: (leave blank for auto)"
Huge thanks for the tip! That would give the best of both worlds!

Last question about this (I know I'm messing up this thread), but, is there a difference in sound/quality between the lower and higher block size renders?
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Old 12-17-2020, 02:59 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by White Sea Studio View Post
Last question about this (I know I'm messing up this thread), but, is there a difference in sound/quality between the lower and higher block size renders?
The VST specs are relevant here (don't know how it is with AUs).
With VST2 plugins automation is processed once per block, so with higher blocks size VST automation is more 'stepped', relevant e.g. when doing 'ramp' automation (there are also plugins which implement their own automation smoothing, e.g. Fab Filter afaik).
In VST3 automation can be sample accurate but the host and the VST3 plugin must implement this.

edit:
Other than that there's no sound/quality difference afaik.

Reaper's own volume and pan automation is sample accurate (regardless of block size).

Last edited by nofish; 12-17-2020 at 07:24 PM.
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Old 12-26-2020, 04:47 AM   #26
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Default No audio input

Hi! Does anyone have audio input to Reaper on macOS-arm64? I don't get any audio input to Reaper 6.19 beta.

On RME forum user wrote "Have you also checked System preferences/Security & privacy for programs allowed to get audio input (represented by a mic icon)?"

I have no apps in there, nor I cannot add an app there (there is no add button). How to make Reaper ask OS for audio input?

edit: Just found a discussion with same problem. He/she somehow added input in Settings. https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=246903

Last edited by frspp; 12-26-2020 at 06:45 AM.
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Old 12-26-2020, 06:44 AM   #27
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Default No audio input

Quote:
Originally Posted by frspp View Post
Hi! Does anyone have audio input to Reaper on macOS-arm64? I don't get any audio input to Reaper 6.19 beta.

On RME forum user wrote "Have you also checked System preferences/Security & privacy for programs allowed to get audio input (represented by a mic icon)?"

I have no apps in there, nor I cannot add an app there (there is no add button). How to make Reaper ask OS for audio input?

edit: Just found a discussion with same problem. He/she somehow added input in Settings. https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=246903
Seems like Reaper does NOT ask macOS for permission to use mic or audio input. So it is not possible to record any audio input to Reaper. This is serious problem with no sensible workarounds. See https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=246407

edit: made a bug report https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?p=2382979

Last edited by frspp; 12-26-2020 at 07:01 AM.
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Old 12-26-2020, 02:21 PM   #28
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I don't think it's a Reaper problem. It seems to happen to some people with other audio apps too.

It's a bug in Big Sur, I think. It works as designed for most users. I have no clue why it happens to some unfortunate souls...
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Old 01-17-2021, 11:12 AM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frspp View Post
Seems like Reaper does NOT ask macOS for permission to use mic or audio input. So it is not possible to record any audio input to Reaper. This is serious problem with no sensible workarounds. See https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=246407

edit: made a bug report https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?p=2382979
Hi! If you have the same problem as me, then I've mentioned a workaround above. Open a Terminal window and type:
open /Applications/REAPER.app/Contents/MacOS/REAPER
(That's my path, use yours if you've placed Reaper elsewhere).
A MacOs window should open asking you permission for the Terminal window to use your Mic. Answer yes and you should be good to go. You do have to do that everytime you launch Reaper though...
The problem does not seem to be Big Sur as I have another setup with an Intel chip where I don't have this issue...
I think it's a Reaper "problem" but what do I know
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