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Old 01-22-2023, 12:40 AM   #1
Andro
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Default Freeze Track, up to last selected FX -> does not work properly

Hi there,

if you select for example the first plugin and start the "Freeze Track, up to last selected FX" function, the incoming routing for all plugins which are not frozen after that, will also be removed. Should not be like that, because also sidechain for example does not work anymore when it is used there. So "Freeze Track, up to last selected FX" is some how not usable!
Or is it possible to adjust this behavior somewhere?

Thanks a lot for your help!
Cheers
Andro
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Old 01-22-2023, 10:32 AM   #2
Justin
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When selecting that, are you choosing the "multichannel" version rathe than the stereo version? That would be necessary to preserve sidechain...
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Old 01-22-2023, 11:36 AM   #3
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Quote:
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When selecting that, are you choosing the "multichannel" version rathe than the stereo version? That would be necessary to preserve sidechain...

Hi Justin, thanks for stopping by
yes, I have tried stereo and multichannel. Where multichannel sounds illogical with a stereo track and also looks strange after freezing? But with both the receives have disappeared. Unfortunately!
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Old 01-22-2023, 03:56 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Andro View Post
Hi Justin, thanks for stopping by
yes, I have tried stereo and multichannel. Where multichannel sounds illogical with a stereo track and also looks strange after freezing? But with both the receives have disappeared. Unfortunately!
if you use sidechain then multichannel is needed in order to preserve those channels!

receives are intentionally removed, as freezing renders their frozen state which is used (rather than the source material).
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Old 01-22-2023, 10:59 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin View Post
if you use sidechain then multichannel is needed in order to preserve those channels!

receives are intentionally removed, as freezing renders their frozen state which is used (rather than the source material).

OK, so even with multichanel it didn't work that the plugins which were not selected to freeze lost their recieves. And sorry, I think this is kinda useless!
Idea is, I want to freeze the synth, but not the compressor afterwards which gets signal from the kick sidechain...????

And as I said, I tried stereo (would be logical) and also multichanel. Unfortunately it does not work!
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Old 01-23-2023, 02:10 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Andro View Post

And as I said, I tried stereo (would be logical) and also multichanel. Unfortunately it does not work!
I've tried multi-channel, but then you got also rendered kick, so doesn't make sense. You have synth on channels 1/2 and kick on channels 3/4, while you still have another track with kick and know all the routing is inside one track, because 3/4 is already in the audio.
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Old 01-23-2023, 05:03 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by vitalker View Post
I've tried multi-channel, but then you got also rendered kick, so doesn't make sense. You have synth on channels 1/2 and kick on channels 3/4, while you still have another track with kick and know all the routing is inside one track, because 3/4 is already in the audio.

Freezing untiel last selcted plugin! Means...
If I have five plugins, select the first, right click, context menu -> Freezing inclisive last selcted plugin! (Means only the first selected plugin is then frozen!).

Then all plugins are automatically deactivated that come after, everything up to the selection is automatically frozen, all deactivated plugins are automatically reactivated.

But if I have a sidechain to the plugin which is not frozen (automatically disabled and then re-enabled) a reciving (3-4) should also continue to work. Because this is not cooled down.... better frozen and therefore not included in the audio!

So far my logic
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Old 01-23-2023, 05:03 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Andro View Post
Freezing untiel last selcted plugin! Means...
If I have five plugins, select the first, right click, context menu -> Freezing inclisive last selcted plugin! (Means only the first selected plugin is then frozen!).

Then all plugins are automatically deactivated that come after, everything up to the selection is automatically frozen, all deactivated plugins are automatically reactivated.

But if I have a sidechain to the plugin which is not frozen (automatically disabled and then re-enabled) a reciving (3-4) should also continue to work. Because this is not cooled down.... better frozen and therefore not included in the audio!

So far my logic
So? I've written the same. I confirmed it is not expected.
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Old 01-23-2023, 05:27 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vitalker View Post
So? I've written the same. I confirmed it is not expected.
Super and sorry

I'm struggling not only with the "frost", also with google translate. English is not the easiest task in my life.... so far! Obviously!
Maybe you can then explain it better than me! HELP PLEASE

Many thanks to you
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Old 01-23-2023, 05:57 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by Andro View Post
Super and sorry

I'm struggling not only with the "frost", also with google translate. English is not the easiest task in my life.... so far! Obviously!
Maybe you can then explain it better than me! HELP PLEASE

Many thanks to you
Well I think you've explained it pretty clear. When you freeze track, all the receives are gone and if you use multi-channel freezing, the receives are render into the freezed audio file, so this fixed signal is used for sidechain, not the original track (with kick in your case). If you change anything on kick track, it won't affect freezed track, because freezed track doesn't have receives anymore.
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Old 01-23-2023, 07:16 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin View Post
if you use sidechain then multichannel is needed in order to preserve those channels!

receives are intentionally removed, as freezing renders their frozen state which is used (rather than the source material).
Is it possible to have an option to freeze stereo (1/2) and keep receives to 3/4 (and other) untouched? Also would be great to save MIDI sends too because sometimes I send midi to MIDI bus 2 to trigger "sidechain". So remove receives to 1/2 and/or MIDI bus 1 and keep other receives untouched. Possible?

Workaround for now is:
SWS/S&M: Copy selected tracks routings
Freeze
SWS/S&M: Paste routings to selected tracks

Last edited by Daodan; 01-23-2023 at 07:34 AM.
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Old 01-24-2023, 01:43 AM   #12
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It looks like Justin has decided that there is no bug. I find this strange because this is obviously a bug!
If that's how it works here, it makes little sense to report bugs at all?

Kind of disappointing!
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Old 01-25-2023, 09:10 AM   #13
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Edit: ah, we'll make it so when freezing to mono/stereo, sidechain-only receives will be preserved. This might break some cases, but I suppose the behavior of this is subjective anyway, and it'll potentially be more useful this way.

Last edited by Justin; 01-25-2023 at 10:05 AM.
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Old 01-25-2023, 10:06 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin View Post
I suppose if:
a) freezing stereo
b) none of the FX being frozen affect channels above the stereo channels
c) some of the receives are to channels above stereo channels

then: we could have it preserve receives to channels above the stereo channels... but there are some significant implementation complexities on the unfreeze side there so it's not a trivial thing.

For now, instead you can put the media and the FX that you'd want to freeze on a child track, put all the sidechaining FX and receives on a parent track, then freeze the child track when you want it frozen.

Hi Justin,
I'll be happy to repeat that again.... because, is just copy and paste


If I have five plugins, select the first, right click, context menu -> Freezing inclisive last selcted Stereo plugin! (Means only the first selected plugin is then frozen!).

Then all plugins are automatically deactivated that come after, everything up to the selection is automatically frozen, all deactivated plugins are automatically reactivated.

But if I have a sidechain to the plugin which is not frozen (automatically disabled and then re-enabled) a reciving (3-4) should also continue to work. Because this is not cooled down.... better frozen and therefore not included in the audio!

So far my logic



You should have a procedure to test something like this in depth yourself if it works or not!
I think no one expects really an immediate final solution for something as complex as a DAW, but already that a bug report is accepted as a help for the developers, that should be so if you want...

Cheers Andro
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Old 01-26-2023, 03:02 AM   #15
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Has been added to the list of next updates!
https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=275261

That was fast and is really cool Sure, it's all about freezing
Am curious whether it works properly then
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Old 01-26-2023, 03:08 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Andro View Post
Has been added to the list of next updates!
https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=275261

That was fast and is really cool Sure, it's all about freezing
Am curious whether it works properly then
I suggest you to check it out while it's still in pre-release, because after that it could take more time to fix.
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Old 01-26-2023, 03:21 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by vitalker View Post
I suggest you to check it out while it's still in pre-release, because after that it could take more time to fix.

Aha, thank you for your hint. I did not know that I can do that and that it is possible
I will do when I'm back in the studio!
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Old 01-26-2023, 03:40 AM   #18
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Aha, thank you for your hint. I did not know that I can do that and that it is possible
I will do when I'm back in the studio!
Yes, you absolutely can and should. But I recommend to install it as a separate portable install, so your original install is untouched. And you should avoid saving projects in dev builds, because not everything will stay as it is now. I mean some features can be changed/removed etc.
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